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Comrades what are your opinions on the Communist Party of Ireland?

I know nothing about the tbh.

 

Does anyone have any support for them and what is everyones thoughts on their politics?

 

Also the same with the Connolly Youth Movement as they're basically the CPIs youth wing.

 

http://www.communistpartyofireland.ie/

http://www.cym.ie/index.htm

 

 

This thread can just be a general discussion on them.

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The CPI has been very supportive of Connolly Soviet. I find them to be very open minded and not interested in the kind of petty sectarianism and cultism that plagues most Left Wing groups in Ireland. They have given us a room to do the Irish classes and the day schools, and when we did the Brendan Lillis protests we were able to store our stuff in Connolly Books, and they donated a picture of James Connolly to present to Roisín, Brendan's partner. I disagree with their support of the GFA. And I'm not even sure how serious their support of the GFA is. I'm sure any Marxist can see through this bourgeois scam, who's only purpose is to institutionalize sectarianism and give the DUP and PSF guaranteed ministerial appointments and jobs for the boys, in perpetuity and ad infinitum - based only on a sectarian headcount.

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Guest Connolly

Dont hear much from them and seem to be very inactive, or small.

 

I dont think their politics would be my cup of tea.

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Dont hear much from them and seem to be very inactive, or small.

 

I dont think their politics would be my cup of tea.

 

What aspect of their politics are you particularly thinking about?

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Guest Connolly

What aspect of their politics are you particularly thinking about?

 

Their leninism primarily. I am not completely in the know on their history, but I also suspect that they aligned themselves to the Soviet Union while it existed, and sought to emulate that type of state capitalism here in Ireland. They were certainly in the authoritarian 'Marxist'/state capitalist spectrum.

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http://www.communistpartyofireland.ie/r-tionol.html

 

 

 

The re-establishment of the Northern Ireland Assembly and Executive

 

Statement by the Communist Party of Ireland

27 March 2007

 

 

The Communist Party of Ireland welcomes the decision to establish an Executive as a major step forward in building peace and reconciliation. While we recognise that the delay may be necessary, any further delays must be resisted. The re-establishment of a functioning Assembly and Executive must become the focal point for resistance in relation to the continuing attacks on public services, the introduction of water charges, and exorbitant rates increases.

The Communist Party also declares that new, radical forms of representation and consultation with the people need to be developed that have the potential to open the path to a new, people-centred democracy and bring real substance to decisions affecting people’s lives, not just in the North but throughout Ireland.

It is important that the working people have a focal point for their political struggles to enable pressure to be brought to bear that will ensure that public services are defended and developed, and that the proposed water charges are scrapped and not just deferred, as appears to be the case.

With the re-establishment of the Executive it is crucial that alternative economic and social policies are developed and campaigned for by the labour movement, to strengthen all-Ireland co-operation in the building of an all-Ireland manufacturing base, centred around the most advanced technological and scientific developments. A central plank of this process must be the development of an all-Ireland plan for the use, exploitation and development of our natural resources, under public ownership, to meet the needs of all our people.

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Guest Connolly

But, in practice, weren't Anarchists quite authoritarian against class enemies in Spain in the 1930s

 

It is one thing being authoritarian against 'class enemies' - and another establishing a capitalist totalitarian state to exploit the working class - which the USSR did.

 

Who would seek to emulate that only non-Marxists.

 

That is not to say that there was much of an alternative to capitalism in Russia, or the USSR while it existed. But I wouldnt call it socialist or set out to emulate it - to hold it up as an example of what we set out to achieve.

 

The anarchists in Spain would probably not be the best example either, if this article is anything to go by http://econfaculty.gmu.edu/bcaplan/spain.htm

 

But how could either be examples of anything when things have changed so much in the last 20 years. Historically, they can be framed as being transitions from feudal monarchist agrarian societies to industrial bourgeois ones. They were bourgeois revolutions. And those who thought they were "implementing socialism" knew no better.

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It is one thing being authoritarian against 'class enemies' - and another establishing a capitalist totalitarian state to exploit the working class - which the USSR did.

 

Who would seek to emulate that only non-Marxists.

 

That is not to say that there was much of an alternative to capitalism in Russia, or the USSR while it existed. But I wouldnt call it socialist or set out to emulate it - to hold it up as an example of what we set out to achieve.

 

The anarchists in Spain would probably not be the best example either, if this article is anything to go by http://econfaculty.g...aplan/spain.htm

 

But how could either be examples of anything when things have changed so much in the last 20 years. Historically, they can be framed as being transitions from feudal monarchist agrarian societies to industrial bourgeois ones. They were bourgeois revolutions. And those who thought they were "implementing socialism" knew no better.

 

To be honest, I don't know the CPI's policies very well. I get the impression that they are and were open minded enough about the form of socialist society Ireland would become. For example, they don't have a specific land nationalization policy. Presumable because they dont want a direct confrontation with the Irish Kulacks. Personally, I think that's a mistake, but it certainly shows that they are tuned in to the local situation, rather than simply copying the model of the USSR. Also its clear that they are willing to work with people who have a different approach than they do. As I say, they have been very supportive of Connolly Soviet, and have never asked for anything in return, and certainly have never tried to influence us or censor the work we do in their building - which is certainly more than I can say about Seomra Spraoi, who set out to censor and restrict us from the first moment we entered their building - and soon asked us to leave because they couldn't dictate the content of our activities.

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http://www.communist...e/r-tionol.html

 

 

 

The re-establishment of the Northern Ireland Assembly and Executive

 

Statement by the Communist Party of Ireland

27 March 2007

 

 

The Communist Party of Ireland welcomes the decision to establish an Executive as a major step forward in building peace and reconciliation. While we recognise that the delay may be necessary, any further delays must be resisted. The re-establishment of a functioning Assembly and Executive must become the focal point for resistance in relation to the continuing attacks on public services, the introduction of water charges, and exorbitant rates increases.

The Communist Party also declares that new, radical forms of representation and consultation with the people need to be developed that have the potential to open the path to a new, people-centred democracy and bring real substance to decisions affecting people’s lives, not just in the North but throughout Ireland.

It is important that the working people have a focal point for their political struggles to enable pressure to be brought to bear that will ensure that public services are defended and developed, and that the proposed water charges are scrapped and not just deferred, as appears to be the case.

With the re-establishment of the Executive it is crucial that alternative economic and social policies are developed and campaigned for by the labour movement, to strengthen all-Ireland co-operation in the building of an all-Ireland manufacturing base, centred around the most advanced technological and scientific developments. A central plank of this process must be the development of an all-Ireland plan for the use, exploitation and development of our natural resources, under public ownership, to meet the needs of all our people.

 

 

Well, yes, one can only say that that statement is naive at the very best. How anyone could imagine that anything radical would come out of a bourgeois representational régime is beyond me. The only thing that comes out of "representational democracy" is the enrichment of the oligarchy, and the consentration of power in their hands.

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Guest Felix Rourke

From the discussions I've heard from them there was always a 'sure Stalin's Russia wasn't all bad line' emanating from them. Ultimately they are correct, but now the task is to always be looking forward, ditch what was bad about the USSR and Cuba, apply parts of the good to Ireland, while realistically envisioning something completely new.

 

I think any transitional period may have to incorporate a low level state controlled consumerism along with the nationalisation of key industries and resources (I'm not convinced that farmland would fall into that - I think rather that its nationalisation could stem more smoothly by setting an example in Oil/Gas, Fisheries, Forestry etc ) and the institutionalisation of democracy into the workplace and the community

 

The CPI organ Socialist Voice was always good any time I read it - the critiques of the fiscal situation in the 26 counties being spot on, but I think their time has passed, for better or worse, with the end of the USSR and a new brand of Socialism is required

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I certainly dont think the time of the Communist Party is past. It lost its way, certainly, but, current events have focused its purpose again. We are seeing a massive and genocidal resurgence of Anglo-Saxon imperialism, with the French trotting along as camp followers. I believe that the only real possibility of putting up an effective resistance to this imperialist resurgence is the Communist Party re-establishing the Comintern, and acting as a unified force over all five continents. A myriad of groups, doing their own thing, will not be able to put up any kind of effective resistance. And not only resistance is needed, but the actual ability to stop imperialism in its tracks. As the Red Army stopped the Nazi horde, a new Red Army will have to halt the Anglo-Saxon horde.

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Guest Felix Rourke

History has been written by the winners of the Cold War, and anti-USSR propaganda is embedded in the vast majority of westerners almost from birth. To continue with that brand of Communism, which nearly by default harks back to the Soviet era, would be a major strategic flaw on the part of the Left in my view.

 

Being caught up by the Soviet era in an internationalist sense, as reactionary Irish Trots are, or caught up in reaction to the PIRA campaign as reactionary Trots also are is equally as bad.

 

I'd say neither react nor adhere fully to Soviet Communism, but take what we've learnt from it, acknowledge its achievements and move on with a new brand, certainly an internationalist one.

 

It appears to me to be a bit like the argument around religion and atheism. In a way atheists only really exist because religion does. We need more agnostics. No anti-Lenninists, and no Stalinists either, we need Irish Socialist Internationalists who stand in the Republican tradtion - Republicanism being the only viable conduit for revolution in Ireland still. Far better to meld a Socialist ideology with a Republican one, than expect the Irish people to gravitate to Communism of the pre-1990 variety.

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I certainly dont think the time of the Communist Party is past. It lost its way, certainly, but, current events have focused its purpose again. We are seeing a massive and genocidal resurgence of Anglo-Saxon imperialism, with the French trotting along as camp followers. I believe that the only real possibility of putting up an effective resistance to this imperialist resurgence is the Communist Party re-establishing the Comintern, and acting as a unified force over all five continents. A myriad of groups, doing their own thing, will not be able to put up any kind of effective resistance. And not only resistance is needed, but the actual ability to stop imperialism in its tracks. As the Red Army stopped the Nazi horde, a new Red Army will have to halt the Anglo-Saxon horde.

 

But how can the Communist Party of Ireland be part of an effective unified anti-imperialist force when it has got things so wrong in relation to anti-imperialism in Ireland?

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But how can the Communist Party of Ireland be part of an effective unified anti-imperialist force when it has got things so wrong in relation to anti-imperialism in Ireland?

 

Thats a very good question, a chara. And I think the answer is very simple - it couldn't. But the CPI are far from alone in accepting bourgeois \ imperialist institutions, and imagining that some good can come of them. Many Communist parties around the world have fallen in the same bog hole. I'd nearly go so far as to say that the rot set in as soon as Lenin published "Left-Wing Communism, an infantile disorder." Because that text was taken far too literally, and used as an excuse to get caught up in the most degenerate bourgeois politiking. Not that the CPI ever did this, but they have lent a kind of legitimacy to a vile sectarian cess pit in Stormont, which utterly forcloses any possibility of class politics - everything is reduced to the sectarian head count.

 

This is all part of the massive task involved in re-establishing the Comintern, and putting it on a properly anti-imperialist footing. Its an almost super-human task, but I believe that the imperialists will keep pushing and pushing - until there is absolutely no other possibility than to set to work on this great task.

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History has been written by the winners of the Cold War, and anti-USSR propaganda is embedded in the vast majority of westerners almost from birth. To continue with that brand of Communism, which nearly by default harks back to the Soviet era, would be a major strategic flaw on the part of the Left in my view.

 

Being caught up by the Soviet era in an internationalist sense, as reactionary Irish Trots are, or caught up in reaction to the PIRA campaign as reactionary Trots also are is equally as bad.

 

I'd say neither react nor adhere fully to Soviet Communism, but take what we've learnt from it, acknowledge its achievements and move on with a new brand, certainly an internationalist one.

 

It appears to me to be a bit like the argument around religion and atheism. In a way atheists only really exist because religion does. We need more agnostics. No anti-Lenninists, and no Stalinists either, we need Irish Socialist Internationalists who stand in the Republican tradtion - Republicanism being the only viable conduit for revolution in Ireland still. Far better to meld a Socialist ideology with a Republican one, than expect the Irish people to gravitate to Communism of the pre-1990 variety.

 

 

In reality, I don't think there ever was any such thing as a "Stalinist." That was just a term of abuse Trotsky liked to amuse himself with. In reality, Stalin adopted the policies that Trotsky himself had advocated in 1920, i.e. not to expect any European revolution any time soon, and to build up the USSR's self sufficiency in heavy industry and consumer commodities. The DPRK has maintained the same policy till this day. I don't think Stalin had any other choice, as things stood in the late 20s and 30s. Indeed, if this had not been done, the Wehrmacht would have cut through the USSR like a knife through butter.

 

As you say, the Trot reactionaries have been slandering the USSR to an even more ridiculous extent than even the imperialists have. But, I think the only healthy approach is to celebrate the massive achievements of the USSR, and, as you say, recognise the fact that we live in a different world today, and that the choices Lenin, Trotsky and Stalin faced are not the same choices that Communists in Western Europe in 2012 face. And, I have no doubt that the CPI takes this approach.

 

However, we should also bear in mind that, despite the bourgeois propaganda, the world as a whole has not greatly changed since the 1930s. Still the vast majority of the world's population are desperately poor peasants, living in places with little or no modern infrastructure. Something like a quarter of the world's population have never made a telephone call. As Communists, our world view must be just that - a world view. Our struggle is the struggle of the vast majority - and the vast majority are outside the privileged societies of the West.

 

This is where Trot \ Cliffites utterly fail. They only address a privileged, Western electorate. We saw in Libya that when the chips are down, they will support the ambitions and fantasies of the petty bourgeoisie - against a highly developed socialist state.

 

In short, we probably defeat ourselves, and fall into a trap set by the enemy, to believe that something completely new is needed to the USSR. I think the future will not involve a complete break from the achievements of the USSR, but will involve the introduction of Direct Democracy to that system - which is something that Fidel Castro has been attempting to do for some time now. Needless to say, Libya also made a very valiant attempt in this direction - particularly in the 1970s and 80s.

 

Just on the first point you make. Again, I think it has been a major error on the part of Communists to try and distance themselves from the USSR - because of the fear that the bourgeois regime has been able to instill in people at the very mention of signifiers like "Stalin" "Gulag" etc. And we see the same process with certain "republican" organisations like PSF, who try to distance themselves from their own history and tradition.

 

To do this is to allow the enemy to dictate the language you use. You hand over the power over all language to the enemy. This is to accept defeat before you start. In my view, its much better to take the opposite approach. Let's shock people. Let's openly celebrate Stalin and the USSR. Do do so is to shatter the power the enemy has over language.

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